Italy’s worst hooligans

Last night I was one of the 5,500 Feyenoord supporters in Rome for the Europa League clash against Roma. This morning I woke up to see everyone from the Italian Prime Minister to the BBC calling for Feyenoord to be punished due to the events of the previous day. I’m here to tell you what really happened at the Spanish Steps, and the story of the worst hooligans ever seen in Italy.

Please note, I arrived in Rome at 1pm on Thursday, so I cannot comment on anything before that.

I arrived at the Spanish Steps in Rome immediately after arriving in the city, following a quick 30 second stop at my hotel to drop off my bag. I had arrived in the middle of a true European away day party, with thousands of people singing, chanting and drinking. Boy, were they drinking.

The Italian authorities had known this was the area that Feyenoord supporters would gather, and yet they had not arranged for any bins or other places to dispose of rubbish. Of course, this meant the area was soon a complete mess, with two main piles of hundreds of discarded bottles in the middle of the square, and plenty more broken glass everywhere. It is of course a great shame that such a pretty part of the city was littered, but it is no different to how most cities in the world look on New Year’s Eve or indeed, a regular Friday night in Cardiff!

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There was also some discarded rubbish in the fountain in the middle of the square, but nowhere near the levels of damage that some media sources are reporting. There were perhaps 30 red and white beach balls, and then another 50 – 75 beer, wine or vodka bottles, not broken and easy to remove. Indeed, I saw a picture of the fountain from 11pm last night and you would never have known Feyenoord had been there.

A flare was set off and thrown on the ground in the middle of the rubbish pile once it began to burn out, with someone drunkenly kicking it. The flare then rolled into the fountain. Oh no! If only water had some way to protect itself from fire…

Soon after this a green smokebomb also ended up in the fountain, again not causing any lasting damage.

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I am by no means saying that Feyenoord supporters acted like angels. We didn’t. We were football fans at a European away game, not a group of priests on a trip to see the Pope. However, it certainly was not out of hand, and many locals were clearly enjoying the experience, a rastafarian man dancing around singing the Jens Toornstra song being a particular highlight, as well as the group of Chinese tourists who got their selfie stick out to take a photo with this young man.

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The only people we did not see were Roma fans. With the game being a 7pm kickoff and their disappointment at being knocked out of the Champions League, it seemed like they were not too bothered. There was not a hint of trouble all day, until 4:30 when a huge group of hooligans brandishing weapons brought shame on football. Feyenoord’s firm the SCF? The ultras from Roma or Lazio? No – the Italian police force.

There had been a huge number of police in the area all day, but at this point dozens more riot vans arrived, with many of the officers not in uniform and wearing scarves over their faces. They had decided it was time to go to the stadium, and rather than making any kind of request or announcement, they began to hit everyone they could see with their batons. Some of the people they hit could well have been hooligans, but many more were women and children. I witnessed a lady facing the police with her hands up be smashed full in the face by an Italian officer, two men getting arrested when trying to go and help her.

The supporters were beaten out of the square and in to a tight street filled with cars and motorcycles. Due to my height I was relatively safe, but many more people were being dangerously crushed. Had the street been two feet narrower and there had been another 200 people around, some of the younger or female supporters could certainly have been very seriously injured.

While this crush was happening,  the police continued to assault people at the back of the crowd, arresting people at random. Bottles were thrown back at the police in anger, and people did fight back, but it is a shameful lie to report that the police were attacked first. It simply did not happen, and all of the trouble which followed was as a result of their poor planning and cowardly love of attacking defenceless people.

It was not over yet.

We then arrived at the buses which we had been ordered to take to the stadium. A plan had been made for the entire away support to walk to the ground together, surely much safer and easy to police than 100 buses arriving at different times? Having ordered us to get these buses, the police then assaulted anyone who tried to do so.

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The first ten or so buses had arrived, and people were eager to get on as quickly as possible. The same bussystem had been used for our group game in Rijeka, and it was so slow and delayed that many people missed kick off. So as supporters tried to get through the doors of the buses, they were beaten back by the police batons once more. I was slightly further back and could see the whole thing happen,  and the numerous horrible facial injuries suffered by regular people just trying to go to the game. It was horrific and completely unnecessary, a police power trip because they knew they could not do the same thing against Roma or Lazio due to the retribution that would follow from the ultras.

After arriving at the bus point at 5pm, we did not get to the stadium until 6:35, a pointless exercise in making the police feel like big men for the day. To add insult to (literal) injury, the stadium had thousands upon thousands of empty seats, ridiculing the idea that there was high potential for trouble and that these actions had been taken for our safety.

So as you read about the events of yesterday,  please keep in mind the real story. There were thousands of hooligans in Rome yesterday, but they were not wearing Stone Island or Lacoste, they were wearing the uniform of the Italian police.

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Posted on February 20, 2015, in General. Bookmark the permalink. 91 Comments.

  1. I completely lost all respect for Rome and Italy. Their prohibition, their coked up hooligan cops, their wining afterwards. How you treat people is how YOU will be treated. I wish the lads would have smashed more. But for 45.000 euro a statue that would have been a bit too much maybe. Is Italy trying the oldest scam in the book? When old crap breaks, let the guest pay for it. Respect to the Feyenoord boys who stood up for their human rights!

    • I do not think that drinking, throwing bottles and in general being an idiot is a human right.

      • Identifying an antique fountain as “old crap” tells you all about the very limited brain cell quantities of this person.
        I am grateful for the swift actions and appropriate verdicts of the Roman judges. In Holland you would have to rake municipal gardens for 40 hours as punishment.

      • Drinking and acting goofy is! Where you from? Iran?

    • A very very angry Rome inhabintant

      I do not need to lose any respect for hooligans as you, since I never had. No damage to the fountain? Have you seen the broken fragments on the photos or were you too drunk to understand what happened? Not a big deal to have such a wonderful place full of rubbish? I guess it could sound as a “normal” thing to you, a barbar as you show you are with this post. If I can’t find a place for my rubbish I do not throw it anywhere. Do that in your home if you like, not in my town. And after that, no problem having smoke-bomb thrown on a monument? A statement like that is too stupid and you are showing you do not know at all what you are talking about. And after that you have some complaints against Italians? How dare you? Perhaps Italians and Romans could speak about what the Police should have done BEFORE, not letting such animals free of stay in our precious places, but not you: you should only feel shame, and beg pardon. And pay for damage. We should put football stadium in desert, so you and people like you can destroy sand and fight one against the other without bothering our lives and our heritage.

      • Ammazza che cretini

        *you are showing you do not know at all what you are talking about*

        Come on, that is such an open door, what did you expect: while the Romans already had a civilisation the Dutch were still running around in their cloths with spears. Nowadays the cloths are changed for football-scarfs and the spears with beer, but apart from that, not much has changed in the last 2000 years…..

      • Ammaza che cretini you don’t know anything about history. And the Dutch might be the most civilized people on earth.

      • Pfffff with the Roma derby similar shit happens. Instead of 2000 agressive cops you could consider to hire about 2 cleaners. Ask yourself who started the fights… if “people” beat me with sticks I would also throw stuff at them. I hope all carabinieri of yesterday get cancer!

      • A very very angry Rome inhabintant

        “The Dutch might be the most civilized people on earth.” I’m sure they are: it is hooligans (dutch, italians english, and wherever) that are not

      • Actually a lot has changed eversince. Back in those days your commanders came to Holland to claim their taxes. Nowadays you need to barrow it from us because you lazy mediterranean bastards wasted all your money

    • unbelievable

    • SHAME ON YOU ! ….AND THE DUTCH GOVERNMENT WON’T FUND FOR THE FOUNTAIN’S RESTORATION. SHAME ! I WILL NEVER VISIT IT EVER AGAIN!

  2. David Gravemaker

    Nice story, but not entirely true. I live here and no, the city didn’t even look like that after New Years eve, in fact is the worst I’ve seen the city in the time living here. You were not there the night before, I wish you did. People were transient the ancient square of campo di fiori without any reason. Before the whole thing started at the spanish steps, already at the top op the spanish steps cars, scooters and motorbikes where trashed and kicked over. I would not even start speaking about piazza del popolo that they already left in pieces 2 hours before the police started their attack. They were warned after entering the fountain that they had to leave, in the Netherlands you get 60 warnings and you would see police begging you to please leave, however in Italy it doesn’t really work like that. This fountain is part of the roman heritage, something that Rotterdam can only dream of. The police attacked and then it was no mistake that whomever would be in between would get hit, bad luck if you decide not to leave with your children to a safer place without all these empty headed people. Women got hit as well? Sorry, I don’t feel sorry for them, people in general got what they deserved. They should’ve indeed had more busses to guide you directly to the airport instead of the stadium. I feel ashamed to be Dutch today, and don’t really wanna see my Roman mates until I’m sure the people get what they deserve.

    • I completely agree with all your statements but i find it a bit harsh that you talk about heritage and Rotterdam in the same sentence because that city was bombed to streetlevel in ww2

      • Ammazza che cretini

        According to a Dutch journalist from the Telegraaf there was no damage after the bombing in 1940……

    • Well Rotterdam doesn’t have any heritage any more because the Nazi Germans (oh did you know that your country were one of the biggest allies from the Germans?) bombed the hell out of it.

      • But what about De Kuip? That is heritage. Even the management of Feyenoord may not touch it… Even as the Erasmusbrug, which makes the skyline of Rotterdam. What if the Roma supporters touched that next week, it would be the fucking same.

      • Lezen is best lastig, maar als je dat dan toch een keer probeert dan kan je aan mijn stukje zien dat ik een Nederlander ben.

    • Ga janken vieze kk nsb’er, die stink Italianen zijn geen haar beter, ga maar op google zoeken naar ultra’s Lazio/AS dan zie je dezelfde taferelen in Europese steden domme lul. En een vrouw en kind mag NOOIT geslagen worden met een knuppel door een juut, als je dit echt vindt hoop ik dat je lelijke kutmoeder of stinkzus een x een knuppel in de’r bek krijgt en blijvende schade oploopt!

      • It is amazing, it can (almost) talk. Never knew people with an IQ< 50 could.
        Of course only basic insulting words and deseases without structure, but still, amazing…..

      • Aan je taal te horen heb je zelf die blijvende schade al opgelopen…..

      • Aan je commentaar kan ik 2 dingen opmaken: 1. Je bent er zelf niet bij geweest, en 2. Je bent net zo dom als die gasten die het nodig vonden een fontein te slopen. Roma en Lazio fans zijn verre van lieverdjes, maar die slopen niet een stad. Maar Dennis volgens mij ben jij niet de slimste, heb ik vast goed toch?

  3. this is a joke, you “supporters” are a joke

  4. Let me guess, it’s the KNVB to blame? Nooo .. there is no KNVB in Italy. Who to blame next? The police! Easy target. Ouch .. the police is decisive in Italy. You made everyone ashamed to be Dutch.

  5. See man, if you say “I am by no means saying that Feyenoord supporters acted like angels. We didn’t. We were football fans at a European away game, not a group of priests on a trip to see the Pope” you’re trying to justify what you did. It’s not acceptable that a bunch of pricks come for a fucking football game and did all the shit you did.
    You can keep trying crying against the police (which made their own mistakes), but still, you act like idiots or hooligans or whatever.

  6. See man, if you say “I am by no means saying that Feyenoord supporters acted like angels. We didn’t. We were football fans at a European away game, not a group of priests on a trip to see the Pope” you’re trying to justify what you did. It’s not acceptable that a bunch of pricks come for a fucking football game and did all the shit you did.
    You can keep trying crying against the police (which made their own mistakes), but still, you act like idiots or hooligans or whatever.

  7. Fountain was looked at by experts: No damage. Only beer bottles and some pyro in the water. Wow, what a damage. 5000 people come together at one spot: you’ll get trash if Rome doesn’t put bins in the square.

    Police were just provoking us, cleaning the Spanish Steps, where there was no trouble, where Bayern fans could stand few months back. But no we couldn’t stand there. The without a warning cleaning the whole square, beating fans at random –> THIS WILL LEAD TO A REACTION obviously. If you weren’t there, don’t talk, because MOST of the media are just trying to blame us for the police violence.

    Source fountain is not damaged: http://nos.nl/artikel/2020347-schade-in-rome-valt-heel-erg-mee.html

    • Well that is pretty funny as the Italian press says something else.
      Who do you trust more, local journalists or a Dutch one that just had a ‘look’ himself without consulting experts?

      http://roma.repubblica.it/cronaca/2015/02/20/news/europa_league_-107752865/?ref=HREA-1

      • Nobody trusts the Italians here because they are a bunch of corrupt rats.

      • nobody trusts Dutch because they’re a bunch of drunk idiots who prefers destroy a fountain instead of looking at before coming back in their useless country

      • Since Donkeys write?

      • Well that useless country keeps helping your useless country because you can’t even manage to control your economics. This useless country helps you guys to control the coast in Italy to prevent illegals to enter your useless country. This useless country helped your country to prevent more flooding. etc etc

    • @FR010: The Dutch do not control and do not help to control anything in the Mediterranean (quiet, Nederlnad is just like other European countries ). As for pay, Italy is the third largest contributor in Europe (after Germany and France) with about 50 billions par years. Of course, it is also true that each country contributes according to the number of inhabitants.

  8. No one likes us, we don’t care

  9. Nazi’s and allies??? Dutch people?? hahaha Italy can never talk to anybody about being friends with Nazi’s please com on know your history!!

  10. Ammazza che cretini

    We wanted to take revenge today but apart from not wanting to lower us to the same level as those baboons, we haven’t found anything cultural or historical of value while walking around Rotterdam this whole morning: The city of Rotterdam is already ugly enough, we can’t make it any worst than it already is even if we tried.
    Guess it is just an inferiority complex and jealousy from those (so-called) Feyenoord fans after seeiing so much splendour and culture that their own city could not even dream of in a million years.

  11. See man of the article, if you say “I am by no means saying that Feyenoord supporters acted like angels. We didn’t. We were football fans at a European away game, not a group of priests on a trip to see the Pope” you’re trying to justify what you did. It’s not acceptable that a bunch of pricks come for a football game and did all the shit you did.
    You can keep trying crying against the police (which made their own mistakes), but still, you act like idiots or hooligans or whatever.

  12. rotterdamisshit

    you should have been executed right there and your dead body left rotten in front of the fountain as a sign for future vandals.

    • That’s it.. But what I don’t understand: hooligans can’t be punished hard enough. Prison, fines which are unpayable for working class people, pictures of faces are seen on billboards in cities. And what do real criminals like child molestors get? Rapists? LOOK AT THE REAL CRIME IN THE WORLD. Fucking hypocrits.

    • You are welcome in Rotterdam next week.

  13. Are your cities styes? Bitch please. They had to beat you stronger, beasts.

  14. Totally agree! Next time italian police had to let drunk people devasting everything, even a masterpiece of Bernini ( confirmed: damage is real and unrepairable).

  15. This is totally fucked up, I’m glad in the comments there are not only italian people saying how idiot this article is.

    I don’t see any true hooligaans-bad cops situation here, I just see some barbars acting like monkeys.Not for the trash, not for the smoke, just for how they did put art under their feets.

  16. You guys are the worst scum on this planet. Destroying the city, pissing everywhere and then blaming the Italian police. They should have beaten you harder, fucking pigs. If you were really a supporter you would have stayed out of the city centre where the drunk and drugged hooligans were, and would have gone to the stadium on time. Lowlifes.

  17. are you seriious ?? your fans are a buch of beer clown ,,shut the fuck you cuntz

  18. Riot police, the type we know and love to hate in Northern European countries go out to these matches having a blast. They do not give a shit about who they’ll be hitting on the day as long as it is somebody to hit. They get paid extra for this and are fully covered by law to do anything they want, they come from all over the place to get stuck in. You’re not assigned, you have to sign in and there’s a waiting list.
    In the Netherlands it’s an option to do before becoming detective, an option that a number of people don’t mind at all.

    As with any away game, you make your presence known(or not of course). If the local authorities do not accept this and you’re to drunk or to dumb you run the risk of spending some time away from the game and you’ll be on your way home or even allowed in for the second half :). In some countries (Spain, Italy and France) local authorities don’t have the faintest idea how to handle football crowds and things tend to get out of hand very fast.

    Following Feyenoord (and on occasion the Arsenal) the experiences below are personal.

    Arsenal – away @ Barcelona . Arsenal, not the most reputable when it comes to casuals/hooligans. Not a single spot of trouble anywhere in the city, were kept after the game for no apparent reason at all. After this taking too long, irritation followed and finally we were “guided” by masked Mossos. This meant for the people which were unfortunate enough to stand on the front of the line to be relentlessly barraged by batons.
    The audacity to ask for some form of apology for the bruises adn gashes was outright ludicrous. Unprovoked or not, you’re with the English so you might as well been ETA.

    Feyenoord – away @ Nancy (2006) Truth be told that Feyenoord has a different reputation then say Arsenal, but still. Feyenoord plays Nancy away for the UEFA cup some 4 to 5 hours away. If you’re quick you finish at 4 or 5 and you’ll be in time for the match. Nancy is located in the grim north of France has 100.000 inhabitants (1/8th of Rotterdam) with a ground housing of 20.000 of which (eventually) 1250 were allocated to Feyenoord some 350 more sold through official channels. In short 1600 tickets were acknowledged, which only for a very limited represent the amount of Feyenoord support present that day.
    Nancy has a large square, with nowt to do and nowhere to go. A police force of “between 250 and 300” (that’s 50 armed and uniformed people not accounted for ?) and the brilliant insight to turn off the beer pumps made very excited group of people very agitated, very fast. With no clue what to do, the police “escorted” the fans to the ground which was now overcapacity and what followed even made the New York Times.

    The lack of a plan involving football away supporters is – imho – the main reason for releasing the hounds. This resulting in some occasions the football supporters are beaten to a pulp and are in no way allowed to complain (Arsenal).
    In other cases the shear volume of football supporters causes utter mayhem to ensue (and again having a lot of people beaten to a pulp in the process) as happened in Nancy.

    Rome yesterday was an example of what happens to a city that is ill-prepared to deal with this.

    Feyenoord @ Basel first run (2004) trouble erupts. 100 arrests (large portion of innocent bystanders) because there wasn’t a plan. Second time around (2006- same year as AS NANCY) nothing (apart from one bar being cleaned swiftly) happened as Basel was now well prepared.

    Feyenoord @ Internazionale – 5000+ in MIlan, 2000+ on the Duomo Square. 800 Police. NOTHING happened.

    No plan and an overeager ill-prepared police force letting a group of people – which you clearly do not want on a certain location- grow in volumes beyond control (let alone the language-barrier) quickly evolves in a large damages claim as eventually very little actually happened.

    The M wasn’t really standing to begin with.

    • A very very angry Rome inhabintant

      I wonder why I should pay a babysitter in my town for grown people unable to behave. 800 policemen at work to avoid damage? If you couldn’t have your candy (beer, yes, you are grown up, I forgot) you get angry like babies? This really sounds normal to you? Please, don’t come never ever back in Rome, this awful city where nobody wants give you a beer (and be sure to tell to all your friend as you too). You are not welcome. Holigans do not deserve beauty.

  19. are you serious , you beer clowns??,fuck off you wankers

  20. I can share your view on Rome’s authorities poor organisation in welcoming supporters. I can also agree on police over reaction (quite notorious for italian cops). But sorry, the rest is hard to digest. A consistent part of Feyenoord fans went way beyond legitimate euphoria, transcending in counterproductive vandalism. Damages on the Bernini’s fountain are not fantasy. And I am not just talking about flares or “harmless” bottles floating. Please check the following photo gallery to verify what I’m telling you.

    http://roma.repubblica.it/cronaca/2015/02/20/foto/feyeneoord_la_verifica_dei_danni_alla_barcaccia-107754291/1/#1

    To be respected you must respect. The way some of your dutch friends behaved in Rome is not to be proud of, even for a hardcore supporter. If you cannot admit this, any other argument you produce loses its credibility.

    SEMPRE FORZA ROMA!

  21. I wish had Benito Mussolini still alive, just to see you trowing bottles or smashing fountains …Stupid motherfucker!

  22. I can share your view on Rome’s authorities poor organisation in “welcoming” supporters. I can also agree on police over reaction (quite notorious for italian cops). But sorry, the rest is hard to digest. A consistent part of Feyenoord fans went way beyond legitimate euphoria, transcending in counterproductive vandalism. Damages on the Bernini’s fountain are not fantasy. And I am not just talking about flares or “harmless” bottles floating. Please check the following photo gallery to verify what I’m telling you.

    http://roma.repubblica.it/cronaca/2015/02/20/foto/feyeneoord_la_verifica_dei_danni_alla_barcaccia-107754291/1/#1

    To be respected you must respect. The way some of your dutch friends behaved in Rome is not to be proud of, even for a hardcore supporter. If you cannot admit this, any other argument you can produce loses its credibility.

    FORZA ROMA!

  23. We are talking only about the fountain, but you also destroyed cars and buildings, it’s plenty of videos just take a look at them.

  24. here´s 5000 in Rome on the day of which I can share numerous people who actually were drinking (very expensive) beers in bars. There were no CUCS/Fedayn or even Irriducibilli to be seen anywhere.

    Of all places and times this specific group could’ve been dispersed relatively easy, they chose to wait till the group was far beyond the point that would make it manageable.

    Damaging cultural heritage is not in any way acceptable, but again at what point did the strong arm find it suitable to act?

    Simply put, if damages are done the culprits can be apprehended quite easily by means of the numerous CCTV units and pictures made by the ever present “Giornalisti” at the scene. Something those in the know are very well aware off.

    The damage to the fountain aside, the shops around the square claim 3 million in damages for business lost. This being laughable set aside they should put that claim with the Mayor’s office in Rome. The square and stairs where cut-off on his authority causing all damages to follow on his behalf (no looting, no windows put through, no nothing.)

  25. It is just a shame the so called “supporters” think they need to make their presence known”. Best way to do so is to support your team. I know for a fact a lot of these people only go to games like this for the vandalism, beer, fighting and trying to be a tough guy. They don’t give a sh*t about the result of Feyenoord. As long as they can fight.

    Trashing a city like Rome or every other city, even if the authorities failled in preparing right, is just a crime. These guys harm the reputation of Feyenoord and the real Feyenoord Supporters.

    Maybe an idea for Feyenoord to deny any supporting for the away game to show their crowd this is unacceptable. And off coarse some people who weren’t involved are struck by such an punishment, I think that’s better than wreck any other cities.

  26. Ferry Lichtenberg

    I am not even sure what is sadder, the destruction of a 400 year old monument, turning one of the most beautiful public placed in Europe into a rubbish tip and depriving local shops of €3m of turnover or the denial that this is not inflicted by a group of Feyenoord supporters.

    Despite the actions of the police and the organisation, as I am sure they made their mistakes, and the media hype, as especially some papers will inflate what happened, the fact remains that this damage is caused by Feyenoord supporters.

    A basic rule of social behaviour is that you do not do what you won’t like to be done to yourself. Another rule is that you look first to yourself what you should have done differently before starting to blame others. Under these basic social rules I cannot ever see why you would throw beer bottles, urinate in the square or throw fireworks and bombs.

    If the police for whatever reason clubs people, you walk away or if not possible do nothing. The last thing you do is increase the tension by throwing bottles, hit back or throw bombs. That makes you responsible for the next person that is hit by the police. If there are no toilets in the square, you go somewhere where there are some. If you would like to show real leadership, you convince others to follow these behaviours and you would not post a blog explaining why it is not your fault.

    It is a sign of immaturity to blame the lack of abiding by these rules on events outside your control. Therefore, the Italian authorities and papers are right. Their city was invaded by barbarians. Having said that, I can only sympathise for the real Feyenoord supporters who wanted to enjoy fun and a great football trip. This experience and now possibly also future ones are ruined by selfish, immature and irresponsible individuals.

  27. If you make the same shit in london or Amsterdam…i think that you will live all your life in a fuckin jail.. I think that problem is exactly the opposite of this arcticle… Bad police organization, and jus few pollice man..

  28. There is to say and reading through the comments, do not emerge many connoisseurs of art, compare the old tub to any fountain that we can find in Rotterdam (1950 nothing good) to something designed and built in 1600 is perhaps not not in heaven or in earth, the pseudo fans to follow the feyenoord not even know where he’s home culture, at least those responsible for the devastation of the Spanish Steps, unfortunately for you I live in Rome, and the damage to the fountain are serious, reconstruction making it the journalist telegraaf is nothing short of fanciful, and just about no one knows what data, missing pieces of the fountain, then I personally think the game of football, a game is useless harmful, given the characters who brought along for that First reason now feyenoord should apologize and participate in solid to the expenses for the restoration of an art object without equal in the world, then also the Dutch state should apologize for the damage caused by its citizens, and ensure better about who sends around the world to represent the Dutch population …. in this case the image of holland and its people is very bad.

  29. Legionnaires Desease

    People bringing up history, culture and beauty as some kind of ‘position’ in this argument miss the point.
    From a historical point of view, it was the Romans who pretty much invented rampaging through Europe smashing things up and generally making themselves unwelcome in mud huts throughout Christendom bringing their ‘culture’ where it wasn’t really wanted at the time.
    As for beauty, this is entire a subjective matter. I happen to think the fountain looks like the kind of thing you might serve an enormous chicken byriani in resting on the largest popadum in the world and just because something is old, doesn’t make it beautiful. Angela Merkel is old, but I wouldn’t want to snog her.
    Bottom line is that this is wanton damage to property that is unacceptable and illegal, regardless of the ‘reasons’.
    End of.
    A Feyenoord supporter from the UK.

    • A very very angry Rome inhabintant

      So, I understand your point of you: you think that coming in my home and smashing down something I feel as precious is a legitimate revenge for something you think Romans has done about 2000 years ago. Surely this sound perfectly logic, yes. Anyway if you do not love monuments and art, it is your right: so, why on the hell didn’t you meet in some place where there was nothing of such insulting beauty? Perhaps you could ask to your team to arrange for its for you and your peers a big fence somewhere with a pool of beer and a fontain of vodka and everyone would be happy.

  30. i think you have sarious problem to justify their behaviour.

  31. Ben Dudley is a wanna be journalist who moved to the Netherlands a year ago (he’s already been to one klassieker) and through this blog is trying to become the spokesperson of the Feyenoord hardcore supporters groups. This is the typical hooligan crybaby rhetoric whereby the police starts using violence without reason and randomly. We’ve seen it all before, but everyone who has been in and around football matches knows it is always possible to stay away from trouble, move two streets further and have a beer and go to watch a match in peace. Supporter violence is always a choice and it pisses me off that blogs like this play it down or glorify it. Ben, please don’t come to Rotterdam and the Kuip anymore, you and your brainless buddy’s are damaging Feyenoord; 99% of Feyenoord supporters is sick of recurring violence in European away games and want you and your friends as far away from this beautiful club and the thousands of REAL supporters as possible.

  32. a comment from a Dutch feyenoord fan! (who was in Rome)

    The damage to monuments in rome is completely unacceptable, people should think twice before they act!

    However the incidents at the spannish Steps could have been avoided, the reception and transportation of fans in Rome was poorly organised by the italian authorities. Italians policeofficers were not hospitable, just plain rude!

    When you receive such a large number of foreign fans you should not allow them to stay at such a beautifull square, instead it would be better to allow them acces to a clossed area, with waste cans, drinks and toilet facilties a dj…..a big party for everyone!

    Things you can organise in advance!!!

  33. The funny thing is that so many miss the importance of what happened the last days and why Italians (Romans) are so upset, especially as lots of Dutch fans seem to trivialize the events as they can not realize the impact it has on Romans.

    Feyenoord fans trying to justify the behaviour of their fellow fans while blaming the police are missing the point.
    There is NO justification for damaging someone else his property, NEVER!

    And I think heaps of Feyenoord fans don’t see (logically) the importance history/monuments have to Romans. Romanisti and Laziali are far from moral philosiphers themselves, you just DON’T touch someones most important property, EVER. Respect has to be earned, it is not given and some unwritten rules should be logical: You don’t disrepspect monuments, graveyards, someones family, someones private property etc etc

    Romans are immensely…. immensely proud of their city (hard to blame them), it is a proudness that borders on arrogance but an arrogance truly justified as the city breaths culture, history and splendour, who wouldn’t be proud being Roman?
    I don’t think lots of Dutch see this signifigance. You should almost compare it to someone putting harm on one of your children, your MOST PRICED asset, as THAT is what it means being born and bread Roman, the city is their child and they are children of the city, it is a bond I don’t think many inhabitants of other cities have as strong as Romans and can not comprehend it.

    This is NOT about some damage to (not meant denagrating) say the ‘van Brienenoordbrug’ or so, this can be more compared to Ajax-fans damaging the statue of Coen Moulijn (the Francesco of Feyenoord if I may use that comparison). You just DON’T!!

    I do think the Polizia (as it was them I think, not the carabinieri) acted like angels, but their behaviour was far more logical than that of the Feyenoord fans that misbehaved and damaged what they themselves didnt see the historical significance of. If you touch the city of Rome, you touch everybody that feels even remotely compassionate with that city, like you touch Feyenoord if you damage the Coun Moulijn statue. You can just WAIT for repurcussions.

    Apart from that: If you are a guest in someones house, I hope you respect the owners rules, so if you visit another city, you should respect that city and its rules, somethings lots of Feyenoord fans obviously didn’t even though the rules in Rome are not that different than the ones in most Dutch cities I think.

    I am truly ashamed as a Dutch that has been adopted (metaphorically) by Romans (it is my 2nd city and I do feel that arrogance and proudness as well) by the behaviour of my fellow Dutchmen, as I would be ashamed if Romanisti would misbehave in Rotterdam next week. So all true Feyenoord/Dutch fans should not look for excuses but appologies for the ridiculous behaviour of a few, as those imbeciles not only damaged Rome, but also the reputation of Feyenoord and Dutch in general. Such a shame that an amazing and deserved result from Feyenoord ON the pitch only gets overshadowed by the disgracefull events OFF it, no one should want that for their club.

    Some things should be universal: respect is one of them, and it is not given, it has to be earned.

    As a Romanista I wish Feyenoord luck for the game in Rotterdam, may the best win and that the game on the pitch may be as good as the one off it next week.

    Daje Magica!

  34. Feyenoord fans are Dutch…The troublemakers are Dutch but don’t represent Feyenoord.
    Now how many people made a mess? Few hundreds? There were over 5000 people in Rome. So the most of the people they behaved in a way that is correct.
    Now again does the club Feyenoord needs to ”pay” for damage for things they didn’t do? Or the people who are making the mess and punish them in whatever kind of way?

  35. ma vaffanculo te e tutta l’Olanda

  36. Surprise surprise…football fans drink beers…and surprise surprise…If they drink too much and they are thousands, troubles can happen…

    Everything was predictable and could be anticipated. Complete lack of organisation, except for the military part…Italian police shows always it’s best when it comes to violence.

    I’m Roman and I lived in the Netherlands in the past. When talking about civilisation we have little to teach to anybody…
    I am going to Rotterdam next week and I got no ticket. Ik wil een kaartje! !!

  37. Om je te bescheuren dit, wat een commentaren. De een nog mooier dan de ander! Klasse mensen, hoog opgeleide, laaggeschoolde opmerkingen, sjapoo! Ik blijf dit nog ff volgen!

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